Physical mediumship in dark or light ???

Jane Lyzell wrote:I wonder what is the point of darkness.

Reel ectoplassma is higly sensetiv to light - thats way!

If light can come in the seans room they whill let us knowe! but in developing i see a danger bringing in the light from the beginning - it might just be telekinesi as you are telling whit tabeltilting- no need for ectoplassma there.

I do agree whit you - I wuldent go an sitt whit a demonstrationg physical medium in dark condishuns - it is not reddy developt then!.and shuld not be oute pubblic.

We agree to differ then Jane. Real ectoplasm is not highly sensitive to light, that is a myth. Only bright white light is a problem, red light or candle light or firelight have all been used for materialisations. I believe direct voice can also be achieved in subdued light. I'm talking about just enough light to see what's going on.

'They' ( spirit guides) have let us know some light can be used, examples DD Home and at present Jo Bradley.

I don't see your point about telekinesis. As David Fontana says, there is no scientific experimental evidence or mechanism to explain the forces involved. How do you know it's not ectoplasm based, with psychic rods, and Spirit involvement, as demonstrated by Dr Crawford with the Goligher circle? Besides, in the dark the same applies, it might be telekinesis if you believe in that, or it might be fraud. Where is the advantage? The main thing is you need a physical medium , perhaps one in a 100,000, before you can do anything. That medium needs to be dedicated and patient and always work in a little light to develop towards the goal of objective survival evidence with love and a caring attitude.

Each to their own Jane, thanks for the discussion.

Normy now you just are refering to open demonstraiton of old physical mediums - How long dident they sitt before the light culd bee brought in:-)

In the development i meen:-))
How is not saying DD home hade telekenisi it is more likly he hade it.Havent heard any reports that any culd se ectoplassmic rods whit hiim - have you?

Ofcource it is more likly it is telekinesi for de many mediums oute there knowe trying to be physical mediums((( - than that is it Ectoplassma!

I'm not convinced that telekinesis is real, Jane, it's just a made up word that has no proof. I referred to Home, he never sat in the dark, and condemned those who did. Nobody but Crawford got evidence of psychic rods but they might be used all the time for all we know.

Telekinesis would be a wonderful new branch of physics, but there is no proof it exists as far as I know. Psychologists call it that, but can't explain how it works.

Im convinst that it exist and so ar the parapsycolegist:-)) - they have don servel of experiments whit that:-))

Home was exepionel and probebly Telekinetisk!!!

Hi Jane,

Many of the early physical mediums never sat in the dark, they developed their work in the light, the myth of darkness started at the same time that the level of fraud exploded. In the late 1800's read the old magazines for the examples and read DD Homes book Lights and Shadow.

DD Home accepted that most of his work was telekenesis but there are records of materialisations, in the light, with DD home in the 1860's.

Spiritualism sold its soul when it accepted Dark Seances. Indeed the NSAC in the USA has banned seances, except in dim red or blue light...even for development puposes and the SNU does not sanction dark seances but is more neutral about showing them.

Jim

Every materalisaiton seans in the past are in som form of light - offcource - but how it vas in de erlie developpment - im not shore!

and that is what Im talking aboute - to develop in darkness to come oute in light when spirit have adjust it(ectoplasman)

In to dim light the shadows can bee misstaken for spirit!

Jane, they just did it then, no training no darkness just sit down and try. If you want to work in the light you must start with it and reach agreement on that intent with your guides. If you start in the dark with guides, that want that medium, you will stay that way.

One of the few dark seance mediums I would trust is Stewart Alexander yet after 40 years of development its still in the dark, apart from a luminous board for the hand. None of them allow infra red photographs, like Jack Webber and earlier ones did, cripes in the late 1800's they used Magnesium Flares as the flash but no one was harmed. We are still using chemistry and guides from the late 19th Century where are all the atomic physicists to act as guides for newer methodologies.

It seems like none of them want to get involved in old seance technology.

Not easily Jane if the light is positioned properly and if its a full materialisation moveing around no mistakes are possible. The USA focus on transfigurations, trumpets and tables.

Ok - what do you men whit trumpets??

And how are the mediums in USA you are refering to??

They use the physical medium style speaking trumpets and look to get them moving (just like the table could be pure telekenesis). They also look to get a voice speaking out of it whilst no one is holding the trumpet (just as they look to set up a communications sytem with Spirit from the table).

Ok - the trumpet is fore comunikation not a circus- and the same whit tabel!
Ho are they then??

There are quite a few NSAC certified mediums who will run these events. The one we had in Adelaide was put on by Rev Anne Gehman. We ran out of time for the trumpet because of teh impressive transfiguration and table work.

The tables were astonishing especially the one Anne, her partner, Lis and I plus a trustee of 55 years and sceptical scientist which ran round the room leaping in the air until a leg broke. We had two tables moving and one vibrating.

However, just like teh rest of the world the number of trained mediums is dropping so teh numbers who learn to do this are falling. These are certified working Mental Mediums for whom this is just a special event.

They look for communication but in a one off event it has more of the circus about it. However Jane remember that Psychic is the basis of all mediumship so to show, in a demonstration, that there is a fundamental psychic force, which allows telekenesis to happen, proves the existence of this field, the same energy which allows us to pick up information via the psychic field.

I use spoon bending as one of my training exercises to reinforce the same point. That there is psychic work and there is the distinctively different step of mediumship being in contact with discarnate intelligence or personality.

Too many people assume that these are one and the same so demonstrating the difference is a vital learning step.

David Fontana's book 'Is there an Afterlife' has been a great influence in shaping my opinions, as to how my personal experiences correspond with his comprehensive overview of evidence of all types of the paranormal. His sections on psychokinetic phenomena are particularly relevant to previous posts about psychic forces, whether from discarnate or incarnated sources. One example is from the Cardiff poltergeist case, which he investigated for two years.

To be honest Normy I reckon Sir William Crookes books about his researches are must read material.

He may have slipped up a couple of times when checking on the pretty Dark Seance "Mediums" Mary Showers and Anna Eva Fay but the work on Home was great.

http://archive.org/stream/researchesinphe02croogoog#page/n6/mode/2up

You can also download it from on the list here
http://www.nasm.org.au/library.html

Along with DD Homes Light and Shadows with its scathing attack on Dark Seances. Now given Home is, in many ways one of the few White Crows, with no proven cheating to stain his reputation, I tend to take on board what he says.

I agree Admin, I have also read the books you mention.

Well that DD Home dident have proven sheting is thepending how you are reding books aboute him - he has to run avay servel of times- accoust fore froude!??

Hi Jane, whilst I am very against any fraud we do need to look at who the accusers are, every single working medium has been accused of fraud or in many eyes are seen as frauds.

One of the saddest things about my research of our history is the actual number that seem genuine declines all the time. Indeed if it were not for a couple of messages I have received, some of teh outstanding messages I have seen mediums give, my own mediumship which I know is genuine and my wife's mediumship I may well have been very sceptical. This especially as so many centres reflect new ageism and psychism, if my first experience had been that style I would have walked away dissmissing mediumship and Spiritualism.

Luckily Spirit ensured my first contact was good in messages and intelligent thinking.

I totaly agree whit you there - is the same for me- I thanks fore the persernly experiens aswell:-)))

And you culd ask Way is it like that - why cant it bee proooven by others!??

Dust this one off to return to the problems of Dark Seances and the past exposures.

Here is some great and very accurate work from Marc Demarest http://ehbritten.blogspot.com.au/2012/12/the-declaration-against-promiscuous.html

Admin wrote:Dust this one off to return to the problems of Dark Seances and the past exposures.

Here is some great and very accurate work from Marc Demarest http://ehbritten.blogspot.com.au/2012/12/the-declaration-against-promiscuous.html

Dark seances should be classed as "training sessions" or "for entertainment purposes only"

Absolutely Wes I agree with that but even then I think the intent should be to start as you mean to go on with at least some dim red light.