New Zealand Spiritualism

He claims he's the only medium in the world to have demonstrated at Speaker's Corner, Hyde Park, London.

A supporter of David Thompson, he say's DT is the only medium in the world to demonstrate physical phenomena publicly.

Azur wrote:He claims he's the only medium in the world to have demonstrated at Speaker's Corner, Hyde Park, London.

A supporter of David Thompson, he say's DT is the only medium in the world to demonstrate physical phenomena publicly.

I couldn't stop laughing - thank you Azur for posting that. 'Pretty' awful I thought.

I remember Ken Pretty from his time in England - very mediocre mediumship.

He then moved to Spain and was equally unsuccessful so moved on to New Zealand where he married the President of a Spiritualist church and has never looked back.

Pretty is pretty awful

His website is hilarious. He claims the spirit world told him that if his book was released in the USA, it would take off like a ''rocket'' - it states further,Publishers, agents and distributors - I need you and that means that we will both benefit!

Serious notions of grandeur.

Azur wrote: Pretty is pretty awful

His website is hilarious. He claims the spirit world told him that if his book was released in the USA, it would take off like a ''rocket'' - it states further,Publishers, agents and distributors - I need you and that means that we will both benefit!

Serious notions of grandeur.

We had rockets on the 5th November.

They turned out to be damp squibs!

zerdini wrote:

Azur wrote: Pretty is pretty awful

His website is hilarious. He claims the spirit world told him that if his book was released in the USA, it would take off like a ''rocket'' - it states further,Publishers, agents and distributors - I need you and that means that we will both benefit!

Serious notions of grandeur.

We had rockets on the 5th November.

They turned out to be damp squibs!

I take your points but many people, not just VZ, take David Thompson very seriously despite the questions remaining unanswered. Clearly until the questionas are answered and the test seances conducted I suspect the majority, especially after the Paranormal Review and Spirit of PN articles, will not be a part of that group.

Yes Ken promotes himself but he has done a decent job for his Church in New Zealand and worked hard for Spiritualism, even if some of his ideas and thoughts differ from ours. In honesty working for Spiritualism, in a manner more reminiscent of the norms in the UK or USA, down under, in either NZ or Aus is not an easy path. Many centres claim to be Spiritualist but, as the said on the Starship Enterprise it is not Spiritualism as we know it from either the SNU or NSAC.

Admin wrote:I take your points but many people, not just VZ, take David Thompson very seriously despite the questions remaining unanswered. Clearly until the questionas are answered and the test seances conducted I suspect the majority, especially after the Paranormal Review and Spirit of PN articles, will not be a part of that group.

Yes Ken promotes himself but he has done a decent job for his Church in New Zealand and worked hard for Spiritualism, even if some of his ideas and thoughts differ from ours. In honesty working for Spiritualism, in a manner more reminiscent of the norms in the UK or USA, down under, in either NZ or Aus is not an easy path. Many centres claim to be Spiritualist but, as the said on the Starship Enterprise it is not Spiritualism as we know it from either the SNU or NSAC.

You have a ponit.

But I can't take anyone serious if they support DT.

Azur

Well, I have now watched those two videos and whatever anyone thinks about Ken Pretty's mediumship, it is not very constructive to just criticise it or call it mediocre. No, I don't think it was the greatest demonstration, but it was clearly a sincere and a well intended one, and no worse than what many mediums in Spiritualist churches around the world offer every Sunday. (That doesn't mean I don't want to see ever better standards of mediumship in the churches). We should be grateful that Mr. Pretty has the dedication and commitment to give his life in service to Spiritualism.

As for promoting his own work - why not - if you are not willing to sell your own work if you believe in what you do - who the heck else will bother. I don't think it means he has an ego about it (though he might), perhaps just a deep conviction of its importance because of the strength of his commitment to Spiritualism.

As for his commitment to the work of David Thompson - I would defend his right to hold such a strong belief in it. I don't feel the same way about Thompson, but that does not mean I have any desire to negate anyone else's position. What I want to see is the work of David Thompson validated by solid scientific evidence, or exposed if it is not genuine. In the meantime, I will remain undecided about its value.

My greatest concern in watching those two video's was that Mr Pretty seems to have allowed himself to become annoyed with the sceptic and in doing so may have made the error of personalizing the debate by his comments about her. There were quite a few comments she made that were very easily refutable had he taken the time to respond. One example - the alleged 1800+ people who had died as a result of exorcism in the last 10 years.

The obvious question in response surely would have been - where? What sort of exorcisms? What religious beliefs were involved in the exorcisms? etc., In other words - were any of those alleged exorcisms performed by Spiritualists? If not the statistics were irrelevant to the discussion and her claim of psychological damage caused by Spiritualism fails.

I am very aware that such programmes as the one Mr Pretty was involved in, are very often geared to edit and omit material which might make mediums appear genuine or competent. I also know that they inevitably choose 'sceptics' who are rabidly unwilling to enter into any real discussion about the phenomena of Spiritualism, or the possibility of life after death. Such programmes are geared not to achieve what genuine Spiritualists hope it will achieve when they agree to be involved.

One balance, however sincere Mr Pretty's intentions, I don't think the videos help the cause of Spiritualism - but then again, sometimes even bad press, turns out to have a positive side to it - and it does at least get people who watch it thinking about the subject and that is a good thing.

Good points, Lis, and nice to hear from you again - I've recently been wondering where you were.

Actually I have seen much worse in spiritualist churches in the UK. the 'sceptic' didn't explain what investigations she has carried out. I didn't think the clips of him working were any good but it is hard to tell in a short clip.

As for David Thompson; I don't know if he is genuine or not but the clip allegedly of Louie Armstrong sounded like someone gargling.

The point regarding exorcisms made by the sceptic looked to me like they were a misapprehension about what Ken was claiming. I thought she was hopeless frankly.

True, personally I didn't think much of her waffle.

I never said he was not genuine, he may very well be.

But the video didn't do him any justice, he came across egotistical in some parts, and aggressive when questioned, not a ideal representation in my opinion.

As for DT what else can be said, his work speaks for itself.

Azur wrote:True, personally I didn't think much of her waffle.

I never said he was not genuine, he may very well be.

But the video didn't do him any justice, he came across egotistical in some parts, and aggressive when questioned, not a ideal representation in my opinion.

As for DT what else can be said, his work speaks for itself.

Hi Azur,

On point 1. I heartily agree - the woman used a series of entirely generalized statements with not a shred of actual evidence to explain what she was actually alleging.

On point 2. I think the man is genuine - but i agree, the video did not do him any favors, nor Spiritualism - but then again I would be interested in seeing what footage was left on the cutting room floor.

On point 3. Indeed, what else can be said!

mac wrote:Good points, Lis, and nice to hear from you again - I've recently been wondering where you were.

Hi Mac,

I have not been around much of late. I have been dealing with other important matters, leaving me with little time to visit the forum or make comments. Hopefully that will change soon!